Transcript - Podcast - The West Live - Thursday, 25 September 2020

E&OE TRANSCRIPT
RADIO INTERVIEW
THE WEST LIVE
THURSDAY, 24 SEPTEMBER 2020

SUBJECTS: Claremont Serial Killer verdict, 2020, Jobseeker and the Federal Budget, New University Campus in Perth CBD, Perth City Deal, Election for Lord Mayor of City of Perth, She Runs, New Baby.

JENNA CLARKE, HOST: Joining me in the studio now is a Federal member for Perth, Patrick Gorman. What an auspicious day for you to join us Patrick!

PATRICK GORMAN, FEDERAL MEMBER FOR PERTH: I know I feel like I could say anything and I'd get away with it.

CLARKE: In all seriousness I guess you're a Perth born and bred. How do you feel? How did you feel overnight? I felt really uneasy.

GORMAN: I saw your tweet and I thought, well I didn't sleep that well either but…

CLARKE: You got a little one.

GORMAN: I got a little one. But, I can't blame him last night. It's yeah I was in year six when this first, was heading into year six when this story first happened that first horrible murder occurred. I just think every West Australian today is just in their heart standing with the families who have just been through the worst decades of their life and I just hope that everyone feels that in a few hours time justice has been done for sure.

CLARKE: On brighter note how are things with you? You've had a crazy year with COVID sort of interrupting your traversing the country between here and Canberra. How's things in the Perth electorate?

GORMAN: Well I've been able to spend a lot more time in the electorate. I was looking at 2020 thinking you're going to spend 20 weeks of the year in Canberra, and that was, as it always is, a little terrifying but it was also the year that we were supposed to get a whole bunch of other things done. But personally it's been a year that I've sort of been really proud of my community. I guess that's the way I try and look at the positives because there's been some awful things, there's been some businesses that are doing incredibly tough and people who are coming through the door of the office who lost their jobs and things but most of what we've seen has been people just really step up and go, I'm part of this community, we've all got a role to play, and that's been lovely.

CLARKE: What have you been hearing? I guess that the benefit of you being here is that you get to see you know people and the general public more frequently. What are people saying to you when they come to visit you in your office?

GORMAN: We seem to come back to those long-term problems saying that, actually just because this pandemic has taught us that it's accelerated a lot of problems we have. Whether it be what we've seen happen in childcare where we really realised just how important that is for making sure that parents can work and do their contribution whether it's in Aged Care where they say look, all these problems have been accelerated because of COVID, but the waiting lists were there beforehand and the lack of staffing, the lack of nursing professionals on call at all times, that was not a COVID problem. That's a problem that’s been there for years.

CLARKE: Yeah.

GORMAN: And even what we see today in terms of support for small businesses facing insolvency and protecting them from some sort of, at times, predatory behaviour, those problems aren't new small business associations. We have known that those problems have been there for years. So, I think it's just made us realise there's a whole bunch of big problems we've actually got to tackle, pandemic or no pandemic.

CLARKE: The word reform has been thrown around a lot. When you think about economic reform when we're considering we're staring down a Federal budget and then a state budget a couple of days later. What are your thoughts? What are your initial thoughts? I guess we've heard a lot from the opposition around increasing Newstart, Jobseeker now. What are your thoughts and what's the reaction of your community members been to your thoughts on that?

GORMAN: Well my community has wanted for a long time say a permanent increase to Newstart. We've got people who have a disproportionate number of people in the Perth electorate to rely on those payments. And it's a one size fits all payment and that really has bothered me for a long time that you've got a payment that is basically helping someone who's maybe 59, doesn't feel a lot of hope that they're going to find a job. That's the same payment that a single parent who is really struggling to balance life or, the young person who just hasn't given been given that start. And so I do want to see some really smart reforms when it comes to Newstart, and I also don't want us to wind it back too quickly I think one of the things that we've learnt out of this pandemic is that you can act quickly when government needs to, but we probably shouldn't, you know, snap it back too quickly.

CLARKE: Yeah interesting we've spoken to a number of social service providers which a lot of them would exist in your electorate being you know St. Bart's and places like that. Is it as bad as people probably out in the wealthier suburbs don't understand just how much people do live on the poverty line here in Western Australia? The haves and have nots are getting even more vast.

GORMAN: Yeah. Western Australia is an expensive place to live and that is a problem that comes out of us being a very fortunate place in many ways. We are a rich economy and therefore we can afford to look after those who don't have a lot. Poverty is not a choice. People don't choose to be poor. The people I talk to who are on Newstart don't, the images that some people have and I don't believe they are, I'm very proud of my electorate I think is the best electorate in the country. I don't play the suburb wars I try to avoid that.

CLARKE: We play the state wars!

GORMAN: The state wars I'm there! So, it is very tough for people who are surviving on those payments. Remember pre-covid it was 240 dollars a week.

CLARKE: Yeah.

GORMAN: And when you think that the first thing that comes out if you’re in public housing is 25 percent goes on your rent.

CLARKE: Yep.

GORMAN: You are not left with much. So when we say people are living on forty dollars a day, it's actually a lot less than that. So it is very tough and, I don't want to live in a society where people aren't able to get by. And I just feel that when you get to questions of things like Newstart, if you're going to spend billions of government dollars trying to leave people out of poverty, make sure that the amount you're spending actually does the job. I feel like so often we have policies sit in the bad middle where we have things that are supposed to actually lift someone out of poverty, we say well we'll almost lift you out of poverty. For me, that's a failure of government and that's a failure of us as a society.

CLARKE: I think I've just really noticed speaking to people like Dr. Betsey Buchanan and also the ladies from St. Barts when you kind of go, I feel that there is this mantra specifically in W.A. like you just need to pick yourself up by your bootstraps. Well it's pretty bloody hard when you don't even have boots to start with. So the people, the line is just so much further back. You have been fantastic in your advocacy around things like Child Care Reform and like you said, Aged Care, they are the right ways to help them moving forward we can bring, move the line forward for everyone. Are you having any traction with the government on these things?

GORMAN: Well firstly these are two areas that are huge job creators and are going to be huge areas of growth. So we talk about taking someone from poverty to a job, Aged Care or childcare are two great ways to give where you can train people, we've got great training here in WA,  we've got great TAFE system and you can get them into work. Yeah, I think there has been a real change in how we approach childcare. We used to remember under this Government when Scott Morrison was the Social Services Minister, we used to it as a social service. The government has switched it back over to being an education provision recognising that it's actually also about young people reaching their full potential so that we're an even stronger economy for the future. There's been some really encouraging things we saw Julie Bishop come out with the Thrive by Five Initiative but there is a shift in our country and I think the government is going to have to respond to that. 

CLARKE: For sure. What are you looking forward to in terms of what are you hoping to find in the budget. Sometimes when we read through those papers there are things that are buried in there potentially for your electorate or W.A. What are you hoping to see in some of the big ticket items though?

GORMAN: Well I want to see the actual dollars for the City Deal, not just the press statement. I want to see the money in there. That for me is probably the first thing I'll look for. I do want to see some more money for child care and making sure that more families can access those benefits, and, I also I see some security for people on Newstart. At the moment they're facing a cliff at the end of this year. A week after Christmas, their payments are going to be cut back to that 240 dollars a week. And you know the people who are the people relying on those payments are the best budgeters. Some of the companies that are facing financial trouble at the moment should go to chat to someone on Newstart because they know how to stretch every single cent. So I want them to have some certainty, I think working parents need some certainty, and some sort of a comprehensive plan for jobs, something that actually says everyone who wants to work in Australia, and there are going to be a lot of underutilised people in our country over the next few years, probably the next decade. Here's how we are going to make sure you can get a job, and a job that gives you security and gives you a decent way of life.

CLARKE: For sure. In terms of I guess there's been a talk specifically around, sorry to keep this local topic but the West Australian Government trying to encourage as many West Australians to get out to the regions to go help with harvest pick fruit only about 400 people have signed up for their subsidy scheme. It's not easy right, it's not easy just to uproot from the city and move to the regions. But I guess we're all sort of bereft, kind of going well how do we? How do we help them? How do we help people get out there to help our farmers?

GORMAN: Yeah well and that's where we could have terrible economic waste where fruit literally rots on the vine. I don't want to see that. I just think keep tweaking those incentives because the first package that you put out, and that's so often the case with governments, you've got to respond to what people are telling you. If people are saying look, I do want to do this but here's my, here's the blockers for me. Then let's have that conversation, let's keep looking at those things, let's look at ways that you can possibly have other Federal incentives that help people go and do that, and also sell that not everything is economics. I just think, you know, if you say, in 2020 I did something I thought I'd never do, I went out, and I actually was effectively helping on a farm or I picked fruit for a few months, like there's a human element to it too. Some people who've had a really tough year might just find they actually really enjoy getting out. It's the same challenge we've got when it comes to getting people home from overseas, moving isn't quick and I know that there's been some critcism saying oh well, you got told to come home in March. If you've been living overseas for the last few years you’ve got kids, or you've got a mortgage or anything else like that, it's not easy to just uproot and go. That's why I got a lot of sympathy for that. Thirty thousand people and it's a sadly growing list who do want to get home. They deserve to get home. Australia's not just for those who are lucky enough to be here today. It's for all of those of us who were born here, are citizens here, and go and do good things over the walk across the world.

CLARKE: Indeed. Speaking of doing good things, we had the announcement over the weekend of the ECU heading to the city. I guess what does that mean? What do you think that that will mean for both the residents in the city? Students? Potential students who might want to come and study over here. What do you think it means to having an educational center, you know, the beating heart of our city?

GORMAN: I think it's fabulous. I'm a strong supporter of education and getting Edith Cowan in there which is really the entrepreneurial upstart university of Western Australia. And I love that they've kind of been bold enough to do that. Congratulations to the academics and the leadership at ECU for kind of, leaning in and making that happen. I know it's something they've wanted to do for a long time. It's going to be good, it's going to make WAAPA, it's already one of the most competitive places in Australia to get into, it's going to get harder. I think that that will be a surprise that you're going to see more national students from other states want to come here to study at that amazing facility. I hope that we see something soon in terms of more TAFE investment in our city. We've got great TAFE'S in Northbridge and East Perth. TAFE is actually in terms of activating cities, TAFE is open 40 weeks of the year. Universities are about 26 weeks of the year so there's nothing else we can do.

CLARKE: Where I would go and pick fruit when I wasn't at uni, just an FYI.

GORMAN: And I worked at McDonald's, so...

CLARKE: Those were the days! No I think, I think just having an injection of some vibrancy where people are keen to learn, not just young people, like old, young, people from different ethnicities coming into the city to make it more of a mixing pot and livelihood around that.

GORMAN: Yes. And vibrancy comes in also all shapes and sizes. I love Perth, I live in North Perth. I walk into the city most weekends. It's a pretty vibrant place, and I'll say to every one of your listeners don't think that the city isn’t going to be finished until 2025. It's a fantastic place each and every day. There is always something happening. There are great businesses. There's a lot of life, you know there's music, there's performances, there are things happening now. And so, I think it's fabulous and the city is a project that's never finished. You know when you think about it, I was at Old Parliament House and I saw they had a recreated office there which had had an old planning document of Perth in the 1970s. And you just look at it and go, gosh that place does look boring. Look at it now! A city is never finished, so I think this is a great building block in that never-ending project. 

CLARKE: Speaking of building blocks we've got a very big election, not the one in the United States in November, October 17th, for the Lord Mayorship. I guess you would be at the front and center to see how all of this is playing out. What do you think that the next Lord Mayor of Perth needs? What skills and personality types and what do they need to possess to make our city the jewel in the crown again?

GORMAN: I've actually got to take a lot of humility because that council has been for many years dominated by big egos and a lot of in-fighting, and so I'm going to take the humility to actually bring everyone together and find that shared purpose. I went and saw a debate amongst the candidates talking about homelessness and how you address that problem. What's really encouraging out of that is that it actually all seems to have a very similar view of what some of the solutions are within the city's control, because not everything, while everyone would like to see the Lord Mayor of Perth to fix every problem, there is only so much they can do. The other thing is just to have a really clear set of priorities and just relentlessly prosecute them because you can get caught up in everything. And the final thing is just governance and accountability. That's what people are not going to have any patience for if people get that wrong. We've had this huge inquiry, people are going to want to see that you are running, it's got to be a gold standard council and I don't talk about the, you know, gold plating of the new council's lounge, I just mean in terms of the quality of the accountability, they have to be one of the best in Australia if not the world.

CLARKE: And also you've got, you kind of just want to see a really good cheerleader for Perth again right?

GORMAN: Yeah! Like when the -

CLARKE: It can't just fall on your shoulders all the time!

GORMAN: When the Council of Lord Mayor's comes to Canberra every year as they do, you know, it's an in-complete team. So it'll be good to have a full team on the field, and it will be good to have someone who actually does be in that voice of the CBD, it has been missing and I've found it difficult even my constituents will come to me and yes you can refer them on to the commissioners and they've done a great job and full credit to them. But, you're not referring them to someone who feels part of the community, accountable to the community, and is living and breathing that dynamic that is public life every day. So it'll be really good and whoever wins I look forward to working with them and I think we've got a great set of people to put themselves forward and that's a really tough thing to put yourself forward. So good on all of them, and I wish them all luck and sone of them I look forward to working with.

CLARKE: Indeed. Speaking of putting yourself forward, you have signed up to support this great new campaign called She Runs which encourages more women to put their hand up for political life. I guess a lot of us would probably look at it and go, that's a hard path, I don't want to go into that minefield that is politics. Interestingly, yourself and we've seen Celia Hammond from the liberal sign up. I love the fact that it is a bipartisan approach to getting women involved in things. It is, however, funded by the US government. Do you think there will be concern? Is it foreign governments infiltrating our political system?

GORMAN: I assume they would be required to be on the register that's run by the Attorney General and other West Australian Christian Porter. So I'm sure that's all been registered appropriately. Let's not kid ourselves, there are lots of things that foreign governments do in this country. There's the UK Chamber of Commerce here in Australia. There's all these things. It's about being open about that, and I think the people who have organised She Runs have said, well look here's what we want to do, who's going to give us the money to do it? And credit to the US government, they believe in democracy building. I think that's a really great thing that they do. When it comes to She Runs, this is one way and anyone should go and google them, sign up, I think they're taking sign ups till about mid-October. Go and put yourself forward because, going on that journey of deciding whether you might want to do it, don't rule yourself out, don't hold yourself back, make an informed decision, this is about helping people make that informed decision with skills so it's a great program and we do need more women in all levels of government and all levels of Parliament and in all political parties. No political party has really gotten to where we probably thought we were on the trajectory when you know, yesterday or the day before, was the anniversary of the election of Dorothy Lyons 77 years. 77 years and we're still not there. So hopefully we can continue to accelerate and get to proper gender equality in our public forum.

CLARKE: Ninety nine years since Edith Cowan, like fingers crossed next year we'll get there!

GORMAN: Fingers crossed!

CLARKE: Now you're expecting a new bubba in December?

GORMAN: I am.

CLARKE: Do we know? Can we get a scope? Do you know what you're having?

GORMAN: Your listeners can't know because I don't know! So no scoop there. I am convinced it will be a girl but my son Leo is convinced it will be a boy. None of us know.

CLARKE: Well we wish you and your lovely family all the best for the new arrival in December. Patrick Gorman, the Federal Member for Perth. Thank you so very much for joining us on the West Live.

GORMAN: Thanks, and great to be on the West Live.